bring change to hosting section to prevent scammers
- Thread starter Siruthuli
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Scamming is a virus, though many steps were taken they happen.
As above sniffdog said, A member with minimum no.of posts would be good.
Providing service to 3 trusted member is a bad idea. How they gonna test it. They move their site and test it with every host every month.
Prevention of scam:
1. Payment processes have resolution center. We can raise complaints over there to block their payment.
2.Always keep the invoices of the host as backup.
3.Take weekly site backups.
4.WJ Mods must get their personal details and keep it confidential.
5.If there are any suspicious things happening on thread,Mod must give atleast 24hrs of time to hosting providers,before they make their details public.
6.Popularity and Trusted rating option must be added to forum, with which users can rate the host.
As above sniffdog said, A member with minimum no.of posts would be good.
Providing service to 3 trusted member is a bad idea. How they gonna test it. They move their site and test it with every host every month.
Prevention of scam:
1. Payment processes have resolution center. We can raise complaints over there to block their payment.
2.Always keep the invoices of the host as backup.
3.Take weekly site backups.
4.WJ Mods must get their personal details and keep it confidential.
5.If there are any suspicious things happening on thread,Mod must give atleast 24hrs of time to hosting providers,before they make their details public.
6.Popularity and Trusted rating option must be added to forum, with which users can rate the host.
newuploader
Active Member
Good idea :D
I just wonder how could you decide that it is the only sensible comment in this entire thread and you comment the same which was already said on 2nd page? duh
Rapidspeeds and boxslots are also registered companies mate
Coming to topic:
We can't just say who gonna scam in next few days or months as it online, everything is virtual. You can't just use the word SCAM as they havn't gone with your money.
Do it yourself:
1. Pay only Montly instead of quarterly or anually (If you don't trust the host)
2. Take daily (if possible) or weekly backup atleast.
You need to be careful before doing anything guys, It's impossible if you want the rose to grow without thorns.. correct me if I'm wrong
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chaudhary9
Active Member
You laughed your ass off because you're a server administrator, not a real business owner. Server admin = tiny worker bee that collects a salary from the owner. An employee is totally different from an entrepreneur.
I'm not going to debate with you, I left a constructive comment and you decided to try to insult me. If you ever attended college, got a business degree, and actually worked in a real start-up company I'm sure you would have some understanding of this.
Running a real business requires a real business plan and sound financial planning and start up capital. Look at how many web hosts run into the ground, that's because they operate month to month, hand to mouth that's why the slightest problem they are caught with their pants down with no funds and have no choice but to abandon ship.
A Registered company isn't the end all be all solution, but its a start. The number of failed web hosts on WJ speaks for itself and the reason behind it all? Lack of Funds. You can't argue that.
@Ludo:
I dont know what he is but he thinks like a business owner.
Business should make profits, buying server in 1year advance is completely nonsense.
example:
RapidSpeeds was legit company etc etc, to prevent a scam i go and buy server 1 year in advance, they dissaappeared, same situation, i got fuck3d like everyone, my users are also fucked (in my case temporarily till i get new server but its still some downtime). Same case like we are want to prevent from that.
people just should have mind open that shit can happens, simply way is just check how long in business provider is, pay month to month or anually not 1 year in advance, try to google them. there never will be perfect solution but these steps can helps
Even if server is paid for 1 year, anyone can go and sell it after two months for discounted price on hosting forums, as i said there never will be complete solution, we can just have eyes open
I dont know what he is but he thinks like a business owner.
Business should make profits, buying server in 1year advance is completely nonsense.
example:
RapidSpeeds was legit company etc etc, to prevent a scam i go and buy server 1 year in advance, they dissaappeared, same situation, i got fuck3d like everyone, my users are also fucked (in my case temporarily till i get new server but its still some downtime). Same case like we are want to prevent from that.
people just should have mind open that shit can happens, simply way is just check how long in business provider is, pay month to month or anually not 1 year in advance, try to google them. there never will be perfect solution but these steps can helps
Even if server is paid for 1 year, anyone can go and sell it after two months for discounted price on hosting forums, as i said there never will be complete solution, we can just have eyes open
@RBN
Its not nonsense, its business basics 101.
If you open a restaurant are you seriously going to only have money for ONE month's rent? What if you don't get enough customers/clients, you'd be assed out of a server for next month.
You think Walmart opened with only enough capital for one month? This is clearly the difference between tiny fry and big successful businesses.
I'm not telling YOU the customer to pay one year in advance, I'm saying the HOST should have funds to pay for the server one year in advance, with enough funds to take a loss for at the very minimum 1-2 years.
There is no total solution, but I guarantee you if you required hosts to be registered companies, and have money to pay for 1 year in advance they will think twice about starting up a web host for FUN. They will be dead serious because that's serious money they are putting on the line.
Look, everyone should do whatever they want, but if your business fails, read back on this post. This would be step 1 of step 20 to starting a business.
Edit:
And you are right, everyone should have due diligence when researching for a web host and their history. Everyone should make their own current backups of their site data. You cannot trust anyone but yourself for your own files and database.
Its not nonsense, its business basics 101.
If you open a restaurant are you seriously going to only have money for ONE month's rent? What if you don't get enough customers/clients, you'd be assed out of a server for next month.
You think Walmart opened with only enough capital for one month? This is clearly the difference between tiny fry and big successful businesses.
I'm not telling YOU the customer to pay one year in advance, I'm saying the HOST should have funds to pay for the server one year in advance, with enough funds to take a loss for at the very minimum 1-2 years.
There is no total solution, but I guarantee you if you required hosts to be registered companies, and have money to pay for 1 year in advance they will think twice about starting up a web host for FUN. They will be dead serious because that's serious money they are putting on the line.
Look, everyone should do whatever they want, but if your business fails, read back on this post. This would be step 1 of step 20 to starting a business.
Edit:
And you are right, everyone should have due diligence when researching for a web host and their history. Everyone should make their own current backups of their site data. You cannot trust anyone but yourself for your own files and database.
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Obviously there is no way to Stop Scammers completely.
But at least some steps should be taken to somewhat avoid them.
1) Post count or Rep points or Brown colored usernames or Golden Fucking Stars aren't going to make any difference.
2) Hosts with constant Service Disruptions should not be allowed. (Scheduled maintenance is an exception)
Proof must be provided for the same. (Hint: pingdom)
3) Address, Phone Number, and Name in the Whois record shouldn't be Private
But at least some steps should be taken to somewhat avoid them.
1) Post count or Rep points or Brown colored usernames or Golden Fucking Stars aren't going to make any difference.
2) Hosts with constant Service Disruptions should not be allowed. (Scheduled maintenance is an exception)
Proof must be provided for the same. (Hint: pingdom)
3) Address, Phone Number, and Name in the Whois record shouldn't be Private
Whois shouldnt be private, i agree with that, maybe some kind of mail confirmation to prevent fake adresses, hmm...
Join date, first post date, how long in business it will help but we cant require from the news some stupid rules... Please not all big fails in hosting marketplace here was not really scams, it was just bad luck 3 or more companies vanished in one month (boxslots, rapidspeeds and that rdp business which i cant remember lol)
Please also note not every RDP hoster will allow warez files (no doubt its using for uploading warez, to be honest) when register legit company.
There was some company which was providing seedboxes, registered a busness and they was closing accounts because of violating their tos (downloading copyrighted material). If someone wants to scam us, will find a way for sure... It's not the point to make selling harder for good sellers...
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- WJ will never be the middle man, because WJ is simple forum, not agency.
- WJ staff doesn't have a crystal ball to look in future, which host will fall down, rules are clear, whatever you do here, its on your own discretion.
- WJ staff ban scammers, however, they can't predict things, or prevent things from happening. Shit must first happen, before someone can point finger.
- You rant, because you were stupid enough to not have a backup of your site, and not have a backup escape plan (backup host, somewhere where you can move in case of emergency) is only telling how you are unprepared to be a webmaster, which is a road full of thorns. Just by knowing how to setup wordpress blog, but forgetting to take backups, makes you vulnerable. Good webmaster should always have backup plans, not just backup of website. So, blaming on host is stupid just like its stupid you didn't had a backup. If you did had a backup, and plan, you wouldn't have time to be here and cry. You would already upload your site somewhere.
- Trust. Silly thing. That is for weak people. (you can freely disagree with me, and show your weakness )There is no such thing on the internet. You can be good with someone, have his msn, type on a daily basis with someone, You can have numerous money transactions with him, and all can go nice and smooth. But he CAN grab the first opportunity to fuck you over. Trust yourself only. Think three times before you do shit. You must think in advance, always, and have backup plans, so called emergency plans. Because shit DOES and WILL happen when you least expect them, it's Murphy's law.
- No one else gives a shit to protect you, or baby sit you, it's your own duty. If you decided to be a webmaster, first thing you have to know is, that you are on your own.
So, before new babies start to cry, learn something from what happened with those 2 hosts. Learn how to create backups, practice it, practice finding another backup host, where you can switch fast and smooth, be one step ahead before the mess. Always have backup funds. Don't let shit run on their own, control the situation. Be a WEB MASTER
Just my 2 cents
@cvrle77, Completely agreed with you opinion. Those who cry for not having local or secondary backup solutions their own, will continue to do so.
@Mods, better close this thread and stop censoring talk. If WJ wants to do censoring, then there is no difference between MPAA and WJ. There is no need to WJ act as a mediator or a Court.
@Mods, better close this thread and stop censoring talk. If WJ wants to do censoring, then there is no difference between MPAA and WJ. There is no need to WJ act as a mediator or a Court.
All I have really seen is people saying "WJ should do something to protect us from scammers". Now my question to you is thus;
Why should they?
This forum is provided free of charge to anybody who wishes to use it to come and learn about a huge range of topics such as hosting, DMCA, SEO and much much more. Not once is it said or written that WJ will hold your hand while you learn how to walk! Getting WJ directly involved with hosting issues is quite frankly stupid and just asking for trouble, it will/would open them up for all sorts of grief and could/would probably do far more harm than good.
That being said nobody wants to be scammed but it is your own responsibility to watch your own back and not WJ's or its staff. I was once scammed in the past and I have learned my lesson from it, if you don't learn from your mistakes then you are doomed to always fail. WJ and its staff do all they can already about banning scammers etc when the situation warrants it but they should never be held accountable for actions of anybody here who sell hosting (or any other service) which would be the case if they get involved. It could rapidly turn in to everybody bitching at WJ and the staff because they were too stupid to be scammed in the first place. Staff would end up with being constantly pestered by childish members with PM's about "ooh such and such scammed me, you must do something because I am too stupid and only I matter at this point in time so you must focus on me and me alone". Now OK granted that is possibly a little over the top but you get the point (y)
Remember if it is to good to be true then chances are that it isn't true.
JGM.
Why should they?
This forum is provided free of charge to anybody who wishes to use it to come and learn about a huge range of topics such as hosting, DMCA, SEO and much much more. Not once is it said or written that WJ will hold your hand while you learn how to walk! Getting WJ directly involved with hosting issues is quite frankly stupid and just asking for trouble, it will/would open them up for all sorts of grief and could/would probably do far more harm than good.
That being said nobody wants to be scammed but it is your own responsibility to watch your own back and not WJ's or its staff. I was once scammed in the past and I have learned my lesson from it, if you don't learn from your mistakes then you are doomed to always fail. WJ and its staff do all they can already about banning scammers etc when the situation warrants it but they should never be held accountable for actions of anybody here who sell hosting (or any other service) which would be the case if they get involved. It could rapidly turn in to everybody bitching at WJ and the staff because they were too stupid to be scammed in the first place. Staff would end up with being constantly pestered by childish members with PM's about "ooh such and such scammed me, you must do something because I am too stupid and only I matter at this point in time so you must focus on me and me alone". Now OK granted that is possibly a little over the top but you get the point (y)
Remember if it is to good to be true then chances are that it isn't true.
JGM.
Well said JGM, the problem that I seem to see (never actually experienced it) but people will call a host a scammer because they don't help with problems that the actual person is experiencing, for example, if a vbulletin php error comes up they'll blame the host straight away before realising that it is actually their fault. People get paranoid with their money and I don't blame them as money is what makes the world go round. Some people just require a bit more guidance which is all fair imo.
If you're a company you should verify it.
You don't want to give your ID to staff, yet you expect random people over the internet to send you money?!
Edit:
But to be clear, I also think WJ shouldn't get involved as JGM says.
??
For you getting rid of scammers is equal to what the MPAA is doing?!
MPAA ARE SCAMMERS.
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FreeFileZhare
Active Member
There is one way, giving special ranks to hosting company like file hosting,but the hosting company should pay a deposit money to WJ, and they can take it back when the company is stable enough.
Jamie Holle
Active Member
What do personal details such as a PASSPORT or driving Licence going to prove exactly ?
He lives in "this address" "can Drive a car" oh yes he definitely owns a company!
it's their choice to send money to whoever they want to. I don't have to give my details out to anyone for them to actually know who I am and what I do!
aah!!
this topic is heavily going off topic.
Guys please understand my request.
I asked if any of us, member or staff can think of a way, which could overcome the problems of scammers.
a way which could reduce the risk of scammers.
one which is sensible.
why shud wj help with this? maybe because they cate for their members ???
adding lines of prevention is not stupid, I feel its good.
in a way, it helps goodhosts grow well, and bad hosts to just get lost.
am sure everyone needs the chance to grow, but we shud stop as many cheap ones scamming us
its just a discussion here, trying to find a way, please dont go off topic or revenge this topic
thanks
this topic is heavily going off topic.
Guys please understand my request.
I asked if any of us, member or staff can think of a way, which could overcome the problems of scammers.
a way which could reduce the risk of scammers.
one which is sensible.
why shud wj help with this? maybe because they cate for their members ???
adding lines of prevention is not stupid, I feel its good.
in a way, it helps goodhosts grow well, and bad hosts to just get lost.
am sure everyone needs the chance to grow, but we shud stop as many cheap ones scamming us
its just a discussion here, trying to find a way, please dont go off topic or revenge this topic
thanks
bhanuprasad1981
Active Member
giving id proof for selling hosting to warez sites ? i don't think its good idea :'(
I think that:
There should be ranks for hosts (even use some css). Every host should have one thread, not a thread/offer.
If that thread is getting older and the host is still alive, after 6 months it should get a higher rank, after 12 months, it should get even higher, etc...
Every rank should have different colors, or something written in the title like ( Newbie host - Half-year host - Yearold host - Veteran host etc.)
Also in the thread there should be a timeline which would be editable only by moderators. There should be written every huge problems by user complains which are trustable, like:
2011.11.16 - Boxslots hacked, lot of user lost their sites
2011.11.31 - Boxslots hacked, user data lost
2010.10.20 - Boxslots down for 11 days
Etc.
Also, there should be a user rating system, five star method, which is only available for users with 50+ posts, so even new hosts would have the chance to get good ratings, but clearly, old hosts will have an upper hand... BUT this way with the timeline every of their huge mistakes will be there above the first post.
There should be ranks for hosts (even use some css). Every host should have one thread, not a thread/offer.
If that thread is getting older and the host is still alive, after 6 months it should get a higher rank, after 12 months, it should get even higher, etc...
Every rank should have different colors, or something written in the title like ( Newbie host - Half-year host - Yearold host - Veteran host etc.)
Also in the thread there should be a timeline which would be editable only by moderators. There should be written every huge problems by user complains which are trustable, like:
2011.11.16 - Boxslots hacked, lot of user lost their sites
2011.11.31 - Boxslots hacked, user data lost
2010.10.20 - Boxslots down for 11 days
Etc.
Also, there should be a user rating system, five star method, which is only available for users with 50+ posts, so even new hosts would have the chance to get good ratings, but clearly, old hosts will have an upper hand... BUT this way with the timeline every of their huge mistakes will be there above the first post.
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