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@Lifetalk:
Don't include vouchers, invite requests and premium accounts in this argument. It's not the same. It's against the terms and conditions of most to resell them and the seller therefore doesn't have the right legally to sell them.


This makes no sense. Let's say it's a vBulletin database he owns and it's legit. Technically the guy can get a cheap domain or one which is about to expire, upload the script (default theme no plugins), import the DB and sell it as a website with no traffic, backlinks or anything but he can't sell that DB on it's own. Only when he adds a shit cheap domain that's about to expire and a nulled version of vB is he allowed to sell it?
You know this way your promoting piracy by forcing him to throw in a nulled version of vb in such a case on what could be a perfectly legit database.




OFFTOPIC:
Whatever the outcome I must say excellent well written points and examples are being put across by both sides. It's one of the most mature, troll free topics I've seen in WJ in a long time. It's enjoyable to read.
 
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For the 2nd time I am supporting Mr.Happy, Selling of Legit Databases should be allowed. BTW, Mr.Happy... How can a seller prove that the DB is original? Suppose, its not a forum script. Then? (May be a DDL one)
 
@Happy
Filehost vouchers are perfectly legal to sell provided you have an official reseller account with the filehosts. We still disallow their sale because it's still risky. So your point is not entirely valid.

Now about the other, like I said, by itself it's perfectly logical to sell databases and I see no reason to disallow it. But, as I've said, the move to disallow them was by experience, not right off the bat. The reason, as you're well aware of, is that the abuse resulting from that privilege was a lot higher than the overall benefit gained by the community. Just do a simple cost-benefit analysis, and tell me honestly, do you think it's worth allowing the sales of databases here on WJ? With the number of immature kids (that have access to God knows what kind of shit) that are here, it would just be us cleaning the mess left behind by them and their attempts to sell illegally obtained databases for 80% of the time, with the other 20% being the only legitimate sales.

I'm not sure if a rule exists that allows the sale of sites hosted on nulled software (most likely not allowed), but if that rule does exist then the person cannot grab a domain about to expire and go through the trouble just to indirectly sell the database. Besides, most people here would not buy the site if it had nothing except content; since in the case of warez, content is easy to generate if you have automated tools. It's the traffic, revenue, etc that hold real value in the sale of a website that is related to warez. Content holds value, but not in the case of warez sites. And I think you and I can agree on the fact that the majority of the database sales here would be warez databases :)
 
I'm not sure if a rule exists that allows the sale of sites hosted on nulled software (most likely not allowed), but if that rule does exist then the person cannot grab a domain about to expire and go through the trouble just to indirectly sell the database.
Click to expand...
First the nulled software rule doesn't exist as a lot of warez forums that are sold use nulled vB.

Second why or where does it say it's not? Their is nothing to stop someone indirectly selling such a DB.

Besides, most people here would not buy the site if it had nothing except content; since in the case of warez, content is easy to generate if you have automated tools. It's the traffic, revenue, etc that hold real value in the sale of a website that is related to warez. Content holds value, but not in the case of warez sites. And I think you and I can agree on the fact that the majority of the database sales here would be warez databases
Click to expand...

About content that's true but not always, neither is traffic. I'll return to the case of SpongeBob though and his site LinkPlz as an example as it's the one I started with and it's a warez site we're all familiar with.

Let's say SpongeBob want's to keep the domain for this link protector. The domain has a lot of linkbacks from various sites and it's rather suited to such a script.
The list of download urls in the database is of no use to a new site as the pages wouldn't link to my new site etc.
Their is far more valuable non visible content though. Take the ratings for sites. This would be a decent indicator to an uploader of what sites are of good quality and worth posting on. On my site wrzc.org I do have a sort by Twilight.ws and MechoDDL function so I'd also be interested in buying this database just for that.
The other part that is useful is the emails and urls of webmasters. If I was an existing DDL site or a new one I could send an email along the lines of "Hey Admin of select from DB, now that the LinkPlz is closed were offering you the chance to submit to our site. Your current rating is select form DB on Linkplz so if you add our linkback and start submitting to us in the next 10 days we will give you the same rating.
Just replace the linkzplz button with ours found at bla bla and start submitting today."

Or something like that. You'd have loads of interested webmasters and a huge amount of linkbacks and submits that could take weeks if it were a new site.

This is one example where you could probably sell a DDL Database on it's own to many people which most could consider useless.
 
Yeah exactly.. I have a vB database of a client which has 30k members :D
But I don't intend to sell it :)
Coz I ain't want to be labelled "Scammer :/"
 
funny5293 - You cant sell it if it is ur client's xD You would be labelled a scammer only if u do so :P If it was urs, u could have shown proof with ur vB license and could have sold it. ;)
 
Why do you need to show proof of a vB licence? Eh?
I could just turn it into a warez forum
And at WJ lots of warez forums are sold with Nulled vB :)
I could just buy a cheap domain, install the vB forum & db with it, then do some changes which will make it look quite different and sell it for $$ or $$$
Although I wont :]
So I think, allowing sale of database should not be allowed.
 
You do have valid point(s) Happy, but like I said, the percentage of legitimate sales like the one you described are going to be exceptionally low compared to the crap that we will have to deal with (and the members too) if we allow the sale. Quality databases/sites are rarely sold on WJ, so you're looking at a 1 in 20 or 40 sales that will actually be some kind of quality.

And going with your example, chances are that not every webmaster in LinkPlz's database will be happy that their emails (and thus their privacy) has been handed over to someone else. Most webmasters prefer to keep their emails private. While you do have a point about the database helping you to kick start your site, there are chances that this strategy could backfire if your site gets labelled as a spam site; you'd need a very good strategy to avoid being classified in that category.

And then of course, there's after-sales issues with databases not importing correctly at times, the seller not being very supportive, etc etc. My point being that the potential problems that will arise out of allowing the sale will most definitely far outweigh the benefits that the community will gain as a whole.
 
I'm pretty sure anything could be stolen or re-sold or any other manner of dishonesty. This topic really serves to enforce the fact that buying online is a risky business and caution should be used. I prefer to live in a world where innocent until proven guilty is exercised but we all know that isn't possible online.

I would say a reasonable outcome would be that whilst Mr Happy has a perfectly valid argument, it isn't one that is likely to pop up on a regular basis, and so isn't worth the juggling act of creating a new intricately worded rule.
 
lifetalk no offence but as u said we wud be looking at 1 in 20 or 40 sales that wud be quality isnt it same case of hosting section sales here... seriuosly lotttsss off noobs and creep hosting sales thread here only rare are good and stable.... so if thats allowed for giving chance to good ones this should be too?..

and as u say potential problems arise of sale.. u cant deny fact that they arise for almost any kind of sales online...

its not abt benifit its more about giving chance to legimate and quality people as we do for our hosting section too..
 
What I'm saying, is out of experience. You cannot compare web hosting to database sales, to be very honest. As much of a valid point you have, it's more of a general point that applies to any sale online, literally.

My point all along has been about probability. We would have to shut down the entire marketplace if we were to look at my points from a global/broad perspective. It's about what is more risky and what does not benefit as much as it costs.

The webhosting industry is, like any other, not without its risks. In this case, though, members CAN exercise reasonable skill and care should they wish to. If they go down, 90% of the time it's their failure to foresee (what they could have foreseen) a potential problem. The general rule in the hosting industry is 'if it's too good to be true, it usually is'. The rule actually applies to anything online, but of late, it's just spot on for the hosting industry. People have come to a point where they now expect oodles and oodles of features for nothing, literally nothing. The recent demise of RapidSpeeds, for example, is something that most should have seen coming; you can not offer what they offered at the price they offered. It just is NOT possible, not now. Maybe 10 years after, maybe.

With a webhost, it's pretty easy to figure out who to trust. Domain and whois lookups, traceroutes, google searches on domains/emails/nicknames/paypal emails, plans, pricing, etc. It'd take a few minutes, tops, for an average member who's capable of exercising reasonable care and judgement to spot whether an offer is good or too good to be true. People are often blinded by cheap pricing for unreal features. If they go down, they're the only ones to blame. And a quick look at the hosting section here shows that there are a lot of quality providers; the 1 in 20/40 rule does not apply there. There may be a couple that are newbies/kids, etc. But you see a majority providing a good service. So no, the database issues don't really apply to the hosting 'industry' on WJ.

As much as we're all for giving everyone a fair chance to do business here, we have to draw the line somewhere. A number of legitimate people will lose out, sure, but we're looking at the bigger picture. Greater good for the maximum number of people.
 
but if we consider that like some known person is selling his/her database like we all know jayfella owns extremecoderz.com (just scrolled up and picked tbh i didnt knew -.- lol ) if he comes selling its database some day... i dont see harm in that i mean i dont see any harm in that?
let it be just anyone selling some database claiming its his... as long as buyer and seller are satisfied i dont see harm?
i mean as u said it wont take 2 mins to go to google and search first that is that website database available over internet for free or not?
if its private database of a site that dosnt exist anymore and person is proving with a dummy site that database is real... than i dont see harm in selling... sorry i am not much of knowledge in this .. but plz correct me if i am wrong

i am jsut taking ur point of googling about product
and same rule apply here too
"if its too good to be true than it is...." if someone is selling stolen it wont be that hard to find out that either.. as there wud be probably news on google somewhere abt that website being attacked or somthing for sure!!


edit: my point being that if its stolen database probably its related news wud be on google...so it just takes some time googling.. before allowing it to be sold?
and there arnt that many database sales on wj anyway so it wont be much trouble too...
 
My god

I have never seen so many present staff, and ex staff within the same thread since El_J & St0ne owned WJunction.


<3

And like databases have not been sold before:

2KjdC.png



 
You guys can always allow only a user who still owns the domain corresponding to the database to sell it. For those who wish to keep domain and sell the DB.

For example linkplz.com, spongebob still owns the domain and he can prove it. So maybe if a user does not own the domain anymore he cannot sell it?
 
Yeah but bx, what if the domain expired and the user wishes to just sell the database? That should still be allowed eh? Also what if there are two owners and one wishes to sell the db but doesn't own the domain?
 
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